Albert Cahalan acahalan at
Mon Nov 26 10:48:21 EST 2007

On Nov 26, 2007 2:47 AM, Edward Cherlin <echerlin at> wrote:
> On Nov 25, 2007 10:57 PM, Albert Cahalan <acahalan at> wrote:
> > Mike C. Fletcher writes:

> > > we need to make use on multi-user machines easy, where Sugar
> > > is just a desktop manager session that is run just as one
> > > would run KDE or Gnome (so that computing lab situations can
> > > let children use Sugar's safe, rich  without giving up the
> > > ability to run KDE/Gnome)
> >
> > Activities which don't need special XO hardware features
> > should just run, right from the GNOME menu, without anything
> > extra. Activity authors should have an easy way to specify
> > if this means full-screen or 1200x900 in a window.
> We have Gnome on the Live CD now. What prevents us from installing it on XOs?

Well, RAM will get you. I don't believe GNOME is all that
important, despite the fact that I use it. I'm using it just
for the task bar thing; I even disabled nautilus and all that
silly desktop stuff. Having a working window manager is
another matter though.

> > I feel like such a conspiracy theorist here, but...
> >
> > The thought that has always come to my mind is "Python cabal".
> > At times it feels like things are maliciously non-standard,
> > as if intended to exclude normal Linux software.
> We need to get that Sugarizing code for non-Python apps like Etoys
> onto a Wiki page.

The crazy thing is that Bert has been a 1-man documentation
shop, despite not being the author of the code in question.
He's some kind of hero. He shouldn't need to be. APIs need
to be documented by the people who create them. There has
been a long-term absolute refusal to do this.

> > A simple xterm should work, no matter if it is started from
> > the console or if it is on a separate machine with $DISPLAY set.
> > Switching to and from the xterm should work perfectly. The icon
> > and title should be used for the donut display.
> I'm sorry, what's wrong with the current standard console and
> Developer's Console? All it takes is Ctl+Alt+F1 or Alt+0.

There are things wrong, but that's not the point. Pretend my
example was xclock, or xeyes, or any other simple thing.

A simple $PROGRAM should work. That means remote
display onto the XO from elsewhere, switching to and from,
the icon getting shown in the donut, the title or icon title
getting shown in the donut, and so on.

(FYI, what is wrong: 4 left pixels cut off on the console,
dreadful font on the console, no CJK or compositing on
the console, only 256 characters on the console, no UTF-8
at all in Terminal, less than 80 columns in Terminal, screen
motion problems with yum in Terminal, etc.  The vttest
program may help.)

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