Frame Decision (was [sugar] OLPC priorities for Sugar in the August release)

Carol Lerche cafl at
Fri May 16 15:29:06 EDT 2008

Considering that a whole key on the key board is dedicated to the frame, why
not use one of its meta modes (shift, alt) to be the toggle for default
off/on of the corner sensitivity?

On Fri, May 16, 2008 at 11:14 AM, Greg Smith (gregmsmi) <gregmsmi at>

> Hi Simon, Marco, Eben et al,
> I think the key decision is to default the frame on or off. In addition
> we should have a long term vision for the frame. For example, is it a
> short cut to find things or a first place to look for key features?
> The only key feature I have heard so far is copy and paste. Task
> switching is more commonly done with the function keys. What else is
> central to the frame concept?
> My main concern is that it pops up. When you don't have good cursor
> control that's a challenge. All activities have UI elements at the edge
> so you spend time trying to get the cursor on the "keep" button without
> popping the frame. Lastly, its a sudden, in your face thing that happens
> without you really knowing why. Setting a longer hover time or only
> opening on some edges helps but it makes the problem of discoverability
> worse (aka user wonders "why did the computer do that?")
> If we default off you can still activate it via key stroke. That would
> be my preference.  That way you get "expansion" of space without the
> mouse control issues.
> Initial research shows that there are FAQ entries for how to disable
> this. I also found these relevant threads in the forums saying they want
> it default off:
> me#p546464<>
> ame#p547914<>
> me#p525210<>
> me#p524796<>
> Several degenerate in to complaints about having to use the CLI :-). So
> enable/disable should be configurable via GUI but we should design with
> an assumption about the default install.
> We need more input from users (e.g. a small usability study would be
> great!). I think Nepal is on record to make it default off. Any other
> comments?
> BTW we brought up a new e-mail list for Spanish speakers in multiple
> countries: A dozen teachers
> have already commented saying they want to share experiences.
> Can someone who writes Spanish well can post a question there to get
> feedback from teachers re: frame experiences? I'll use a translation
> tool to do it myself if no one gets to it by the end of next week.
> I hope this is not seen as a negative criticism of your work. The UI is
> great overall. We can live with whatever frame solution is agreed and
> there is a solid case to be made on all sides. Let's get the maximum
> info to make an informed decision, then its your call :-)
> Thanks,
> Greg S
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Simon Schampijer [mailto:simon at]
> Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2008 8:42 PM
> To: Marco Pesenti Gritti
> Cc: Greg Smith (gregmsmi); devel at
> Subject: Re: [sugar] OLPC priorities for Sugar in the August release
> Marco Pesenti Gritti wrote:
> > On Wed, May 14, 2008 at 6:26 PM, Greg Smith (gregmsmi)
> > <gregmsmi at> wrote:
> >>  Thinking about the "hot corners" pop-up frame thingy, Nepal asked
> >> that  be deprecated and I agree based on my personal experience and
> >> that of my  kids. The only thing I have heard people use it for is
> >> the copy and  paste functionality. Waveplace lead mentioned that and
> >> its used in the  Uruguay training presentation linked above.
> >
> > Simon is working on making this an option. We would still need to
> > decide about the default obviously...
> >
> > Marco
> These sugar rpms include a control panel option to set a delay for the
> frame activation and an option to toggle the top of the screen to
> activate the frame.
> <>
> You need to install sugar and sugar-toolkit (rpm -U [package] should
> work fine). I tested on joyride 1918.
> The control panel can be accessed with the palette on the XO in the home
> screen.
> Best,
>    Simon
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