[laptop-accessibility] keyboard for the blind

Rakesh Chand chand at connect.com.fj
Tue Oct 23 02:35:27 EDT 2007 

Certainly Peter,

That's why we prefer using guide dots. You're correct Peter about the F & 
the dot on J. But for elderly people and some times for myself we find it 
hard with just a light simple dot. Perhaps a heavier dot may make the 
difference. Further on, Keys like (enter), (backspace) or, in case of 
Function keys a dot is always a plus.... needs to have a dot so its 
recognised quickly.

I use a PC at work or a Laptop at times my biggest obstacle is time, or 
speed, what a blind person needs in open market is to put his or her hand & 
within seconds be able to identify keys for a quick & speedy job. Perhaps, 
that wil mean the same for a child sitting in examination.

So guys,on the job, have a great evening!

Rakesh

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Peter Korn" <Peter.Korn at Sun.COM>
To: <walter at laptop.org>
Cc: "Samuel Klein" <sj at laptop.org>; "Discussion of accessibility on the 
OLPC" <accessibility at lists.laptop.org>; <bigone at qon.lao.net>
Sent: Tuesday, October 23, 2007 3:51 PM
Subject: Re: [laptop-accessibility] keyboard for the blind


> Hi Walter,
>
> I believe the XO already has a single dot on the 'f' and 'j' keys, which
> is sufficient to locate the home row, and from there to use the home row
> for chording Braille text entry if that were desired.
>
> I can't imagine anyone wanting a full Braille representation on the keys
> themselves.  For one thing, it wouldn't be localizable...
>
> Regards,
>
> Peter Korn
> Accessibility Architect,
> Sun Microsystems, Inc.
>
>> We were debating whether or not it would make sense to make a version
>> of the OLPC keyboard that had raised dots for Braille. I imagine that
>> it would be relatively easy to make a new mold for the rubber membrane
>> keyboard. We'd consider it if it was useful globally--a percentage of
>> these keyboards could be included in every order. But it isn't clear
>> that would be particularly useful.
>>
>> Of course, we'd need to get the back-end support working as well.
>>
>> -walter
>>
>> On 10/22/07, Aaron Cannon <cannona at fireantproductions.com> wrote:
>>
>>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>>> Hash: RIPEMD160
>>>
>>> Hi Manu.
>>>
>>> I just want to clarify some things.  First, when you say Braille 
>>> keyboard,
>>> do you mean a regular keyboard with Braille labels on the keys, or a
>>> keyboard that will allow the user to type in Braille?
>>>
>>> I assume the latter, but would just like to make sure.
>>>
>>> There are two general types of Braille in use in the world, six-dot and
>>> eight-dot.  Most languages use six-dot Braille.  This is the type of 
>>> Braille
>>> used in the English Braille Code, the new Unified English Braille code,
>>> Braille music, the Nemeth Braille code for mathematics, Spanish Braille, 
>>> and
>>> many others.  An eight-dot code is also sometimes used for certain 
>>> foreign
>>> languages, as well as certain types of computer Braille.  Many 
>>> manufacturers
>>> of Braille keyboards simply make the 8-dot type, and the users just 
>>> don't
>>> use the lower two keys.
>>>
>>> If those were the only differences, then there would be no problem.
>>> However, making a computer understand Braille requires not just getting 
>>> the
>>> Braille into the computer, but also translating it to print.  This is 
>>> much
>>> more complex than it may seem at first glance.  Because Braille was not
>>> designed to be read by computers, there are several ambiguities.  (There
>>> were bound to be; you have only 63 dot combinations in 6-dot Braille, 
>>> and
>>> they have to represent close to a hundred different symbols.) 
>>> Fortunately,
>>> these ambiguities are quite obvious to a human.  Unfortunately, they are
>>> quite difficult for a computer.  If that weren't bad enough, many 
>>> Braille
>>> codes, including English and Spanish, employ contractions.  Braille is 
>>> big,
>>> and one way we reduce the size of Braille is to write in short hand.
>>> Contracted Braille in English is very well defined, but unfortunately, 
>>> it is
>>> still often ambiguous to computers.
>>>
>>> There is a publication available from the National Library Service for 
>>> the
>>> Blind and Physically Handicapped, a division of the Library of Congress,
>>> which gives some details about each of the formalized Braille codes in 
>>> the
>>> world.  If you'd like I can dig up the title.
>>>
>>> Are you considering making the Braille keyboard a separate USB device, 
>>> or
>>> replacing the existing keyboard with the Braille keyboard?  I would 
>>> strongly
>>> recommend keeping it separate.  Blind people have been typing on 
>>> standard
>>> keyboards for years with absolutely no problems, and many prefer doing 
>>> so,
>>> my self included.
>>>
>>> However, if you are in fact planning on making a separate Braille input
>>> device, then by all means, go for it.  Just know that getting the 
>>> Braille
>>> into the computer is the easy part.  Back-translation to print is what's
>>> hard.
>>>
>>> Finally, a third alternative is to simply use the standard keyboard for
>>> Braille input.  Whether or not this will work will depend on the 
>>> hardware,
>>> but many blind people type Braille on a standard qwerty keyboard.  They
>>> press the f, d, s, j, k, and l keys in various combinations to make the
>>> different Braille symbols.  I've done it my self, and it seems to work 
>>> ok.
>>> I think I prefer a true Braille input device for typing Braille, but I 
>>> could
>>> probably get used to it.
>>>
>>> Anyway, I hope that that helps.
>>>
>>> Let me know if you have any further questions or need any 
>>> clarifications.
>>>
>>> Aaron
>>>
>>>
>>> - --
>>> Skype: cannona
>>> MSN/Windows Messenger: cannona at hotmail.com (don't send email to the 
>>> hotmail
>>> address.)
>>> - ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: "Manusheel Gupta" <manu at laptop.org>
>>> To: "Aaron Cannon" <cannona at fireantproductions.com>; 
>>> <bigone at qon.lao.net>;
>>> "Peter Korn" <Peter.Korn at sun.com>
>>> Cc: "Discussion of accessibility on the OLPC"
>>> <accessibility at lists.laptop.org>; "Walter Bender" <walter at laptop.org>;
>>> "Samuel Klein" <sj at laptop.org>
>>> Sent: Monday, October 22, 2007 10:48 AM
>>> Subject: Re: [laptop-accessibility] keyboard for the blind
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> Thanks Aaron, Peter, and Big One(Sorry! I don't know your name) for the
>>>> introduction and help.
>>>>
>>>> Me and Walter are currently working on the development of OLPC-Braille
>>>> Keyboard.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Aaron, you wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> What adaptations are you considering?
>>>>>
>>>> We are at an initial stage, and are in the process of looking for a
>>>> suitable
>>>> layout.
>>>>
>>>> The first question we are searching about, at the moment is: Is Braille
>>>> in US the same as Braille in India as Braille in China as Braille in 
>>>> Peru?
>>>> If so, we can sum up with a separate keyboard mold for use
>>>> everywhere--economies of scale.
>>>>
>>>> Any pointers/feedback about it will be highly appreciated.
>>>>
>>>> Regards,
>>>> Manu
>>>>
>>>> Manusheel Gupta
>>>> One Laptop Per Child Inc.
>>>> http://laptop.org
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 10/22/07, Aaron Cannon <cannona at fireantproductions.com > wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>>>>> Hash: RIPEMD160
>>>>>
>>>>> Hi Peter.
>>>>>
>>>>> I wrote to the person leading the effort as well as CCing the list as 
>>>>> I
>>>>> thought it would be of interest.
>>>>>
>>>>> I got the information from the weekly email update to the
>>>>> community-news at laptop.org mailing list from Walter Bender:
>>>>> "18. Keyboards: Manusheel, Sayamindu Dasgupta, Roshan Kamat, Tushar
>>>>> Sayankar, Jens Peterson, and Walter Bender have finished the layout 
>>>>> for a
>>>>> Deva keyboard (See http://wiki.laptop.org/go/Devanagari_Keyboard ). We
>>>>> hope
>>>>> to finish the Nepali and Pashto keyboards in the coming weeks. Manu is
>>>>> leading a discussion on an OLPC keyboard for the blind. Please send 
>>>>> your
>>>>> ideas/feedback to manu<at>laptop<dot>org)."
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Aaron
>>>>>
>>>>> - --
>>>>> Skype: cannona
>>>>> MSN/Windows Messenger: cannona at hotmail.com (don't send email to the
>>>>> hotmail
>>>>> address.)
>>>>> - ----- Original Message -----
>>>>> From: "Peter Korn" <Peter.Korn at Sun.COM>
>>>>> To: "Discussion of accessibility on the OLPC"
>>>>> <accessibility at lists.laptop.org>
>>>>> Cc: <manu at laptop.org>
>>>>> Sent: Sunday, October 21, 2007 11:09 PM
>>>>> Subject: Re: [laptop-accessibility] keyboard for the blind
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi Aaron,
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I have been informed that you are in the process of designing a
>>>>>>>
>>>>> keyboard
>>>>>
>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>> the blind for the XO.  Being totally blind my self, and having 
>>>>>>> learned
>>>>>>>
>>>>> to
>>>>>
>>>>>>> touch-type at age six, I am curious about the project.  First, why 
>>>>>>> is
>>>>>>>
>>>>> it
>>>>>
>>>>>>> believed that a specialized keyboard is needed?  Is there something
>>>>>>> unique
>>>>>>> about the current XO laptop which makes it difficult to touch type
>>>>>>>
>>>>> with?
>>>>>
>>>>>>> What adaptations are you considering?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> You have reached an e-mail discussion list, where folks interested in
>>>>>> accessibility for the OLPC/XO discuss these matters.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I am not aware of any work going on around a specific "keyboard for 
>>>>>> the
>>>>>> blind for the XO".  However, if someone is working on that, it is a
>>>>>> reasonable guess that they might be on this e-mail list.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> From where did you hear this?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Peter Korn
>>>>>> Accessibility Architect,
>>>>>> Sun Microsystems, Inc.
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> accessibility mailing list
>>>>>> accessibility at lists.laptop.org
>>>>>> http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/accessibility
>>>>>>
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>>
>>
>>
>
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